GiantsFan83 (here you go)

[HollywoodLeo]

Just think about it like this, GF.

If steroids didn't help you in baseball why would half of MLB risk jail time and public scrutiny to take them?

[GiantsFanatic]

Allot comes into play when it comes to hitting the ball farther.
How tall is the pitcher? Where is his arm angle when he throws the ball? Whats the velocity? How tall is the batter? Where is the ball thrown to? High? Middle? Low? Whats the batters initial velocity when he begins his swing, to when he makes contact with the ball? Whats the weather? Is it windy? Is the wind blowing in? Is it blowing out? If so what distance? Whats the altitude like? Below sea level? Above sea level?

Its not as simple as "roids make you hit the ball farther"

[HollywoodLeo]

Never mind all the physics. I'm not enough of an expert in that matter to bother attempting to argue it.

Just answer the question in post 31

[GiantsFanatic]

Just think about it like this, GF.

If steroids didn't help you in baseball why would half of MLB risk jail time and public scrutiny to take them?

Because some got a doctors perscription to take it when recovering from injury. And some took it to prevent being injured.

[realmofotalk]

My answer is that nobody who has ever played in the MLB has gone to jail for using steroids.

[HollywoodLeo]

Because some got a doctors perscription to take it when recovering from injury. And some took it to prevent being injured.

So, that's the case for everyone on Mitchell's list?

Why did Bonds' trainer risk jail time to covertly give Bonds the cream and the clear?

It doesn't add up.

People don't take these kinds of risks because they like to live on the wild side.

If it didn't help them they wouldn't do it.

[HollywoodLeo]

My answer is that nobody who has ever played in the MLB has gone to jail for using steroids.

fair enough (for now, Bonds may go next year, albeit indirectly)

They're still risking other stuff they wouldn't have to be risking for what would be no reason whatsoever if GF83 was correct.

[GiantsFanatic]

There is no point arguing about this. Because I'm not changing my stance.

Its like an atheist and a Preist arguing the existance of God, where there is no point of arguing about it, because the conversation wont go anywhere!

[HollywoodLeo]

Actually it's not like that.

God's existence can not be proven until you personally witness whether or not he exists when you die.

Steroids either do or do not help you in the game of baseball.

I'd venture to guess that because a shit load of people risk their careers and public scrutiny to take them that they give them some sort of boost in the game.

And your continuance of pointing at scrubs and their lack of HOF numbers makes little to no sense.

Since you agree that roids can help you in football, do you think that if I took steroids I'd be a good middle linebacker capable of playing in the NFL?

[GiantsFanatic]

Never mind all the physics. I'm not enough of an expert in that matter to bother attempting to argue it.

Just answer the question in post 31

I missed this quote

So your saying your not an expert, then yet your telling me that I have no common sense and no logic, and yet I have made a legitimate point after points on this subject

[HollywoodLeo]

I missed this quote

So your saying your not an expert, then yet your telling me that I have no common sense and no logic, and yet I have made a legitimate point after points on this subject

I'm saying i'm not enough of an expert to explain why it helps.

The only thing you told me was that there's other factors involved that can also affect how far the ball flies off the bat....factors that are present whether or not someone is on steroids.

None of that refutes whether or not someone can hit it farther if they're stronger.

It'd be like me telling you "it's not as simple as you can or can not be more physical if you take steroids. There's other factors involved, such as how fast you're running, the angle you're running at towards the person you intend to tackle...etc etc"

I don't need to be an expert in physics to know what sound logic is, and you haven't used any of that in this thread.

But, none-the-less, I digressed in that post and decided to go another route.

And you have still yet to adequately answer the question, because not even half the people on Mitchell's list were prescribed steroids.

[McKain]

Allot comes into play when it comes to hitting the ball farther.
How tall is the pitcher? Where is his arm angle when he throws the ball? Whats the velocity? How tall is the batter? Where is the ball thrown to? High? Middle? Low? Whats the batters initial velocity when he begins his swing, to when he makes contact with the ball? Whats the weather? Is it windy? Is the wind blowing in? Is it blowing out? If so what distance? Whats the altitude like? Below sea level? Above sea level?

Its not as simple as "roids make you hit the ball farther"

These are the words of (GF83). Take them in, people. You may never see idiocy this big again.

[GiantsFanatic]

Actually it's not like that.

God's existence can not be proven until you personally witness whether or not he exists when you die.

And how much steriods help or did not help cannot be proven, I'm on the side it doesn't help as you think, and your on the side it does.

Since you agree that roids can help you in football, do you think that if I took steroids I'd be a good middle linebacker capable of playing in the NFL?

I never disagreed before about steriods helping in football.
It all depends on you, whether or not if you have played football before? How muc experience do you have? If so then yea you can play in the NFL. If your someone who has never played before and has no knowledge of the game, then no you cant.

[GiantsFanatic]

I'm saying i'm not enough of an expert to explain why it helps.

The only thing you told me was that there's other factors involved that can also affect how far the ball flies off the bat....factors that are present whether or not someone is on steroids.

None of that refutes whether or not someone can hit it farther if they're stronger.

It'd be like me telling you "it's not as simple as you can or can not be more physical if you take steroids. There's other factors involved, such as how fast you're running, the angle you're running at towards the person you intend to tackle...etc etc"

I don't need to be an expert in physics to know what sound logic is, and you haven't used any of that in this thread.

But, none-the-less, I digressed in that post and decided to go another route.

And you have still yet to adequately answer the question, because not even half the people on Mitchell's list were prescribed steroids.

Why dont you reread post number 34, the second part.

[HollywoodLeo]

And how much steriods help or did not help cannot be proven, I'm on the side it doesn't help as you think, and your on the side it does.

Dude, this is not a theological debate.

Just because neither of us have the adequate know-how to fully explain why it helps (or doesn't) does not make it a matter of opinion that can't be proven.

Steroids either help you play baseball better or they don't.

I'm willing to bet that because a lot of players are willing to risk their careers and PR to take them that they assist them in some form or fashion.

I never disagreed before about steriods helping in football.
It all depends on you, whether or not if you have played football before? How muc experience do you have? If so then yea you can play in the NFL. If your someone who has never played before and has no knowledge of the game, then no you cant.

So you admit that steroids can help you in football but they don't necessarily make you a football player?

So how come you think that scrubs taking steroids and not putting up HOF numbers proves that they don't help you in baseball?