...and the 2010 _______ award(s) goes to.....

[love_that_reefer]

Have you ever looked at the explaination for Total Zone Rating? It's complete BS! The guy who developed it can't even explain it. There's even ESTIMATION involved! How can you have a SABER stat with estimation? It's a completlely stupid and useless number

That's not the only one. Most saber stats are more like theories which is why I don't give them any more weight than any other stat. People who think WAR and UZR are gospel really upset me.

[NYgiantsfan5689]

I completely agree. WAR is completely useless. I haven't even looked into UZR and I don't intend to

[ljshorty89]

The definition of the word estimate is "to appraise or evaluate approximately." In other words, he's trying to evaluate is precisely as he can while acknowledging that no measure will ever be perfect. Additionally, his calculation uses three methods, and you're harping on one of them without clearly understanding it.

On the other hand, don't sit here and act like shitty stats like "innings played" and "errors" are better judges of someone's defensive skill. Errors, for example, are entirely based on a scorer's opinion. You also gave no data disproving the fact that Jeter's range being significantly less than that of others makes him unqualified to be the GG winner.

[NYgiantsfan5689]

I did. He had the 7th most chances in the AL. That means of all the SS's in the league, he got to the 7th most balls. 3 of those people ahead of him had more innings played. Therefore, he isn't just sitting there. He's getting to ground balls at not a higher rate but not such a shitty rate either. One, that's high enough that, paired with 6 errors, can qualify for a gold glove

[Saber]

I can back up that Jeter sucks.

Watch Jeter play short. Now watch the other team's shortstop.

[NYgiantsfan5689]

You people sicken me. I just don't see where you can make these claims. It's because he's a Yankee, and everyone loves to hate the Yankees. I'm fine with that, but don't cloud it by saying he sucks and doesn't deserve a GG. Just say you dislike him for being a Yankee.

[love_that_reefer]

I don't dislike Jeter or the Yankees as a team. I just know Cliff Pennington was ten times the SS Jeter was and that's who I thought should have won it.

[catman]

A case can be made for Elvis Andrus as well. He had an outstanding season, defensively.

[catman]

Here is a story about Jeter's Gold Glove: Derek Jeter Won The Gold Glove Because He’s Old | FanGraphs Baseball

[Saber]

Why would I hate a guy who's not that good defensively and who's about league average with the bat?

[NYgiantsfan5689]

The bat has nothing to do with GG's, first of all. 2nd of all, I will say that if I were picking, I would have chosen Andrus to win. I am, however, defending the choice given because I dont' think it's as horrible as many are making it out to be.

[Porter]

GF, I'm sorry but Jeter doesn't have the same lateral movement as he did 5 years ago and really ARod could play better SS than Jeter if they ever let him. There had been talks for years to move him from there because of his lack of range. Sure, when he gets there he doesn't make many mistakes. He wouldn't even be the 3rd best defensive SS in the AL West, when everyone is healthy (Pennington, Andrus, Jack Wilson when alive). He's not the worst SS. But this was honestly a bad pick, you don't even agree with the pick yourself lol. It's like Jerry Jones, saying that Wade Phillips is going to be his coach for the last 4 weeks then finally realizing that he's lost his football team.

Let's go into the total chances argument that you bring up. He's made 553 chances in 151 games. YuBet had 692 in the same amount of games. Erick Aybar had 50 more chances in 21 less games. Lets go to putouts+assists per game, which is very basic:

Those who have played in at least 130 games
Alexi Ramirez 4.79
Cliff Pennington 4.56
Yuneski Betacourt 4.46
Elvis Andrus 4.34
Erick Aybar 4.01
League Average 4.00
Cesar Izturis 3.96
Marco Scuatro 3.86
Derek Jeter 3.62

Of the 9 SS that have played more than 130 games, he's 7th in chances, 8th in Assists/Putouts per game and per 9, but 1st in errors.

[Tobywan]

Can open, worms everywhere.

I just don't see where you can make these claims. It's because he's a Yankee, and everyone loves to hate the Yankees.

Bingo, don’t I say that in just about any thread having to do with the Yankees. Then if that doesn't work they pull out the old “someone else got the award, not MY pick, so the winner must be must be crap” argument..

[Kingdom]

Hey, so, if I go change my name to Derek Jeter, will MLB mail me a gold glove next year? I could use a paper weight.

[Saber]

Remember when Raffy won the GG for playing 28 games at first base?