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Thread: McCoy -- Reds should trade both Kearns, Pena for pitching

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    McCoy -- Reds should trade both Kearns, Pena for pitching

    McCoy -- Reds should trade both Kearns, Pena for pitching

    The 1869 Cincinnati Red Stockings, baseball’s first professional team, traveled 11,877 miles — presumably by mule trains, railroads and paddle-wheelers — and won all 70 games they played, including by 130-8, 80-5 and 94-7, probably a three-game series against the Kansas City Royals.


    When the season was over, the profits came to $1.39, which put a crimp in the postseason team party.

    The 2005 Cincinnati Reds lost 89 more games than their founding fathers, but the bank account is in much better shape, despite the fifth-place finish and a downturn in attendance from disenchanted fans.

    How does this get fixed? Does anybody have George Steinbrenner’s cell-phone number, or better yet, the numbers and password to his checking account?

    Let’s pretend that Major League Baseball commissioner Bud Selig called me and said, “I want you to be chief executive officer and general manager of the Reds. Fix that franchise, pronto, so that it is competitive in 2006.”
    Hey, commissioner, you want to do something with the fishes and the loaves, too?

    First, there is more money to spend than the $60 million budgeted for next season. Close to $40 million will arrive from television, radio and Internet revenue, plus the sale of the Washington Nationals.

    Take at least $20 million, and boost the payroll to $80 million.
    We need a franchise player, a star, a marquee player for marketing purposes. We already have one in Ken Griffey Jr. So when the Chicago White Sox or New York Yankees call and say, “Ken Griffey Jr.,” we say, “Can’t hear you. Bad connection. I’ll call you back in about six years.”
    Did anybody notice what the Reds did without Griffey in September? After the All-Star break, the team was 28-20 through Sept. 4 — the day Griffey hurt his ankle and was done for the season. From Sept. 4 through the end of the season, without Griffey, they were 10-21.

    So Griffey is the center fielder. End of story, end of discussion.
    Left fielder? Adam Dunn. Sign him now to a five-year, $50 million deal. The guy is going to hit 40 or more home runs for the next 10 years, draw 100 walks, score 100 runs, drive in 100 runs.

    Some folks want to move him to first base and trade Sean Casey. Have you seen Dunn play first base? Not good. And he doesn’t like it. While his glove in left field is fool’s gold, he is getting better.

    Some fans howl that Casey doesn’t hit enough home runs to play first base. I’m still searching the rule book to see where it says, “A first baseman must hit 25 or more home runs.”

    Home runs aren’t the problem. The Reds set a club record with 222 this year, and as manager Jerry Narron said when asked what it meant, “It means that pitching and defense win games.”

    Casey is going to hit .300. He is going to hit doubles. What he did this year was hit .312 with nine homers, 75 runs and 58 RBIs while playing most of the season with a bad shoulder. And that bad shoulder most likely contributed to the 27 times he grounded into double plays.

    Something has to give in right field. Neither Wily Mo Pena nor Austin Kearns were happy with the share program. Both said they and the team might be better off with a trade.

    Trade one? No, trade both. The Chicago Cubs love Kearns and the way he tears down the Wrigley Field bricks with line drives. And trade Pena to Washington before that team is sold and GM Jim Bowden is replaced.


    Bowden brought Pena to Cincinnati and adores him.

    Pitching is what this team needs, and it might be able to pry a couple of good pitchers away from the Cubs and Nationals.

    While Narron and his staff believe Ryan Freel is best used as Elmer’s Glue — plug him in anywhere and cement the lineup — he needs to be batting leadoff every day (37 steals last year). Put him in right field, and leave him there.

    The biggest hole among the positions is second base, and there is an answer. Pick up the option on Rich Aurilia, put him at second and leave him there. The option is mutual at $2 million, a bargain these days for a good player, and if Aurilia is told he’ll be the regular second baseman, he’ll come back.

    Playing off and on at third base, shortstop and second base, while batting anywhere from second to eighth, Aurilia led the team with a .343 average with runners in scoring position.

    Shortstop is in good hands (well, sometimes those hands get clanky) with Felipe Lopez.

    If defense wins games, third base remains a problem. Edwin Encarnacion may or may not be a future star, but he is only 22 and might have been rushed. His defense remains a slow work in progress, and while he showed power, he hit only .238.

    Wonder if Joe Randa would come back? He is a free agent after the season, and his offense and defense are worth pursuing.

    The catching tandem of Jason LaRue and Javier Valentin combined for 28 homers and 109 RBIs, a Pudge Rodriguez/Johnny Bench type season.
    Valentin is a switch-hitter who hits much better left than right, while LaRue bats right, giving Narron a chance to mix and match.

    While LaRue is arbitration-eligible and will be expensive, alternatives are few. No catcher in the organization is close to major-league ready, and trading for a good one is difficult.

    Pitching, pitching, pitching. Pitching, pitching, pitching. That’s what it is all about. This team led the league in nearly every offensive category, but was at the bottom of the league in pitching.

    Pitching, of course, is the most difficult commodity to acquire. Teams don’t trade top-shelf pitching. It usually is acquired through free agency, and the funds are limited, especially with the $25.5 million invested in Eric Milton, loser of 15 games.

    Can we talk a team with a big, big park into taking him in trade? But Milton was much better in his last three starts. Probably, we’re stuck with him and have to try to fix him and pray he is better next year.

    Ramon Ortiz? Gone. We don’t bring him back and use the $4.55 million on his option to try to do better. Randy Keisler? Gone. He flunked his test as a starter.

    Brandon Claussen showed good signs and awful signs. Luke Hudson has great stuff if he throws strikes. Aaron Harang? A keeper.

    The team needs to find two starters, maybe three. That’s a tough task.
    And it needs a closer. David Weathers filled in admirably in the midseason, but got tired and wore out. Billy Wagner might be available and might be worth the investment. This team blew too many late leads.

    Perhaps we’ll use the Bowden method — sign every mid-level free-agent pitcher we can get our hands on, throw ’em all against the wall and maybe Pete Schourek or Pete Harnisch will stick.

    Maybe that won’t make for an undefeated season like the 1869 Reds, but at least it might make a profit of $1.40.

    Hal McCoy covers the Cincinnati Reds for Cox News Service. He can be reached by e-mail at hmccoy@DaytonDailyNews.com.
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    Past his age-27 peak Saber's Avatar
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    Freel locked in the outfield, Aurilia at second, and Randa at third? To top it off, trade both Kearns and Pena?

    Do you know what that equals?

    100 losses.
    Quote Originally Posted by love_that_reefer View Post
    Pressure is a bullshit argument. Its up there with how many rings a person has and some other ones I'm too stoned to care about.

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    Hall of Famer Slyder's Avatar
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    Ya Aurilia could be a 1 yr wonder, then do like D.J. and show why so many teams passed on him last year. Let him go to a team like the Twins and watch him self destruct. Leaving Freel at 2b with Olemado and/or Bergolla as the backup, or if both still need more time then find next years cheap vet to come in and fill the bench and save 1.7 mil.

    Dunn=LTC thats a given.

    Trading both Kearns and Pena could be a huge blunder, I think Denorfia could be a really good #4 OF but time is needed to see if he could start. I would trade Pena to the highest bidder, because you can deal with having 1 average outfielder defensively but you cant have 2 adn Kearns maybe the best of them (not named Griffey). Because of his ceiling Pena is bound to get you at least one good starter (Maybe package Pena and Milton to Washington savings of 8.5 mil a year).

    Free Agency I would go after A.J. Burnett or Kevin Millwood and make either of them my ace (5-7 mil for 3 yrs).
    With the established ace set for the season, I turn my eyes to the rest of the rotation. Milton and Ortiz are both gone leaving Harang and Claussen as the only guys with good experience as starters.

    If Penny is there for 3-5 mil I would gamble and take spend it on him for a 2 yr deal with a 3rd yr team option for 6-8 mil as an added incentive for him to pitch well. And get him in to work out with Harang.

    Sets up: Burnett/Millwood, Harang, Claussen, Penny and whoever we get for Pena.

    Closer I would heavily go after former Farm Hand B.J. Ryan, hes been absolutely nasty for Baltimore. He could be your closer for the next 5 yrs and take pressure off of Ryan Wagner and others like aging relievers David Weathers and Kent Mercker. Farnsworth will never sign here and besides those two there arent any truely young dominant arm relievers on the market. The others have way too much risk involved.

    You can never have too many pitchers. I would want to look at some vets just to bring in and see how they compete for spots or bargain basement prices: Scott Sullivan. True he hasnt been healthiest of guys the last few years but you never know when someone might get over the injuries. Another I would inquire with would be Al Reyes of the Cards. Hes been superb for them this year and at around 1-1.75 mil would be well worth the investment to pitch and work with the younger guys.

    Edit:Free Agent List I used
    http://1908andcounting.blogdrive.com/freeagents.html
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saber
    Freel locked in the outfield, Aurilia at second, and Randa at third? To top it off, trade both Kearns and Pena?

    Do you know what that equals?

    100 losses.
    Like it could get any worse? This article is about 4 months too late. Kearns should have been traded ages ago along with Pena. Aurilia has had past success so calling him a one year wonder is a little silly.

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    Past his age-27 peak Saber's Avatar
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    Actually, it could get much worse.

    Kansas City worse.

    Especially if this hack McCoy gets what he wants.
    Quote Originally Posted by love_that_reefer View Post
    Pressure is a bullshit argument. Its up there with how many rings a person has and some other ones I'm too stoned to care about.

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    That's why they need pitching. Not Kearns and Pena.

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    The Reds are the Texas Rangers or Baltimore Orioles of the NL

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    Always with the talk of trading one or both. It's really not that simple. If it was, they would have been traded 2 years ago when this discussion first started. What top pitching prospects are getting offered to them? What the hell does Bowden have?

    It gets annoying. The Reds should keep their young, cheap players that have bright futures. That means, until a good offer comes along, that Kearns and Pena get the corners, Griffey plays center because he'll never move, and Adam Dunn plays first base. Sean Casey is the weak link, and should be the first player you even consider trading.

    Stop thinking you can trade your way to a division crown.
    Quote Originally Posted by love_that_reefer View Post
    Pressure is a bullshit argument. Its up there with how many rings a person has and some other ones I'm too stoned to care about.

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    Hall of Famer Slyder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by love_that_reefer
    Like it could get any worse? This article is about 4 months too late. Kearns should have been traded ages ago along with Pena. Aurilia has had past success so calling him a one year wonder is a little silly.
    I didnt say he was, I said that he could be. Hes going to be 34, theres been much better players hit the wall at that age, plus look at the park he played in this year and it helped him greatly.

    One thing was looking at Aurilia's numbers that pointed me toward letting him go, just incase he over acheived in the 2nd half of the year:

    Away from GABP .231 BA, .296 OBP, .325 Slu, .622 OPS
    3 HRs of 14 came away from GABP (and guess where 2 of those came in? You gotcha that pitcher friendly park known as Coors where 350 ft fly outs turn into 400 ft HRs).

    18 rbis away from GABP.
    He feasted on many of the bad pitching teams and was famine against most of those top rotations.

    Away games usually isolate any advantages that hitters and pitchers might have. Yes he will have 81 games at GABP but do we really want to go with that away from GABP or only play him on home games for 2 mil next year, when its not even guarenteed that we will be in contention next year either?

    Edit: Heres a link to the stats I used
    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/player...ting&year=2005
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    Hall of Famer Slyder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saber
    Always with the talk of trading one or both. It's really not that simple. If it was, they would have been traded 2 years ago when this discussion first started. What top pitching prospects are getting offered to them? What the hell does Bowden have?

    It gets annoying. The Reds should keep their young, cheap players that have bright futures. That means, until a good offer comes along, that Kearns and Pena get the corners, Griffey plays center because he'll never move, and Adam Dunn plays first base. Sean Casey is the weak link, and should be the first player you even consider trading.

    Stop thinking you can trade your way to a division crown.
    Dunn's already said he doesnt want to move to 1b perminantly. But with the way FO has handled things wouldnt surprise me if they did it just to spite him again.
    HollywoodLeo: You and Kingdom always annoy me
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    RIP Cyan 2000 - 2017 Providence A's's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, but Aurilia is the least of the Reds problems IMHO

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    Hall of Famer Slyder's Avatar
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    tie 2 million up in him and trade Pena or Kearns though or keep either/or/both Pena 22 (300k) or Kearns 25 (i think about a mil and a half next year) and start Aurilia at 2 mil at 2b at 2 mil next year?

    I thought that was what this was suppose to be about.
    HollywoodLeo: You and Kingdom always annoy me
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    RIP S3SL Minnesota Twins.

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    Rebuilding the Dodger Blues
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    Terrence Long was never the A's biggest problem. Still doesn't mean it wasn't a good idea to ditch him.
    Quote Originally Posted by love_that_reefer View Post
    Pressure is a bullshit argument. Its up there with how many rings a person has and some other ones I'm too stoned to care about.

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    RIP Cyan 2000 - 2017 Providence A's's Avatar
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    Long was a "cancer", I didn't think Aurilia was...plus Long had a bigger contract for some reason IIRC...the A's OF was a problem,getting rid of Long and get Kotsay was a better deal. The Reds need pitching...is Aurilia going to get them pitching or is his $2 million going to get them pitching? No. Well...maybe bad pitching

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    Hall of Famer Slyder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Providence A's
    Long was a "cancer", I didn't think Aurilia was...plus Long had a bigger contract for some reason IIRC...the A's OF was a problem,getting rid of Long and get Kotsay was a better deal. The Reds need pitching...is Aurilia going to get them pitching or is his $2 million going to get them pitching? No. Well...maybe bad pitching
    Aurilia rubbed a lot of fans the wrong way with his mantra "play me or trade me" even when the team was clearly out of it and giving younger guys like Encarcion, Bergolla, Olemado, Denorfia, etc a chance to play to see what we have coming up for Spring Training next year. I do not know if that affected the team, but you got to ask yourself that question when a guy hitting .190s (at the time) demands playing time.
    HollywoodLeo: You and Kingdom always annoy me
    "Oh, don't mind me, I'm rebuilding now" then you win at least 80 games

    RIP S3SL Minnesota Twins.

    RIP HSL Anaheim Angels

    Rebuilding the Dodger Blues
    Renewed Start back in the land of 10,000 lakes

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