Settle a bet

[zodious]

Ok... Why?? What stat does stuff generally translate to? What stat does control generally translate to? and what stat does movement generally translate to? Do you still stand by your bolded statement?

From what I've gathered is stuff seems to translate into Ks control into BBs and movement a combo of Avg and Ks.

SPs will get hit but if they can strike out batters they'll get out of jams easier.

MRs need to control and fool hitters and not allow hits to maintain leads I don't need so many Ks.... That said I could be completely wrong... Just a few things I've noticed lol. What do YOU like OM? When you point a finger at someone you have 3 pointing back at you!

[Kingdom]

No amount of offense ever wins without the pitching to back it up. A top flight pitcher>hitter in a vacuum.

You know that goes either way in a sim league. Sure, you beat Colorado's unstoppable offense in S3SL. But you also lost to my offense years before that. I think good pitching will beat good hitting, but I think it could be the other way around, just out of the unpredictability of OOTP 6.5

[Molina00]

My understanding is that stuff relates to strikeouts and hits allowed, control is obviously walks, and movement determines how many homeruns a pitcher will give up. A pitcher with ratings of say 10-10-5 should have fewer hits than innings pitched, a high strikeout total, low walks, but a lot of homeruns allowed. I personally value stuff/control higher than movement, but if you can get all then great.

Regardless, the trade you proposed would be an easy veto. The White Sox draft position is going to give them a beast of a draft pick (Ted Williams went first in this years draft). I wouldn't say I necessarily value pitchers over hitters. It all depends on the player and how good they are or could potentially be. In defense of Mangino, he fell victim to a poorly auto-managed Cubs team last year (54 GS, 193 ER and 197 walks).

[cjkalt]

Thank you zodious for posting this... I was wondering if I was going crazy thinking Mangino was a #3 SP...

I'm trying to figure put the value of Herme Escobar cause I've been out of MSL for a bit so I'm off a bit, thoughts?

[Providence A's]

If you have a great defense, you don't need high stuff pitchers. If your defense is terrible, then yes.

[OrioleMagic]

From what I've gathered is stuff seems to translate into Ks control into BBs and movement a combo of Avg and Ks.

SPs will get hit but if they can strike out batters they'll get out of jams easier.

MRs need to control and fool hitters and not allow hits to maintain leads I don't need so many Ks.... That said I could be completely wrong... Just a few things I've noticed lol. What do YOU like OM? When you point a finger at someone you have 3 pointing back at you!

My friend, there are no fingers pointing anywhere! Merely, thought provoking questions.... and now debatable answers that are not original with me. (I learned from a piss drunk General the value of Avoid K's....)

Movement translates into homeruns so many would agree that Movement is most important with stuff slightly edging out control for the latter two. Slyder seems to love the high control guys and has clear success.

[Kingdom]

From my experience, I want my relievers and closers to be high stuff. And 10-6-10 would be perfect, usually, for me. I look back on some of my favorite and also best relievers I've ever had: Eric Brooks, Ricky Pickett, Jason Michaels Jr., Patrick Delossantos, the guy in TPSL that I can't remember right off the top of my head, etc. I want my reliever to not mess around and strike the damn guy out. And until this season, Pickett was 10-6-9 or 10-5-9, but dominated.

I think to answer the SP question, I would tend to lean towards 6-10-10, and possibly 10-6-10 if the stuff was legit enough (I always value the strikeout or more an inning stat, for any pitcher really). That's just me. The 10-10-6 option is a killer though, cause of the amount of homeruns that will be allowed.

And to answer the trade question, a 10-7-8 isn't the greatest pitcher ever and typically you'll have the 3.80-4.50 type of a season. I do like Pesky except for his lack of speed, and if he fills out, he's a nice #2 hitting infielder. And the pick will be a good prospect because the White Sox are ugly. Actually, it would be the top pick right now, which would either be a 10-10-10 or almost all 10's hitting legend. Bad deal for the White Sox. The pick a lone could fetch a lot more than a barely above average #3 or 4 SP.

[Providence A's]

OM, you should have learned that lesson when Jon Asahina and Bruce Chen whipped your ass in the last TPSL version 1.0 World Series. Those guys were 6,8,10 type guys and they will always succeed if you have a superb defense. I remember you insulting Bruce Chen and Eric Chavez defending his honor with an 8 RBI game.

[OrioleMagic]

OM, you should have learned that lesson when Jon Asahina and Bruce Chen whipped your ass in the last TPSL version 1.0 World Series. Those guys were 6,8,10 type guys and they will always succeed if you have a superb defense. I remember you insulting Bruce Chen and Eric Chavez defending his honor with an 8 RBI game.

I did learn the hard way in losing some trades with you!

[Providence A's]

That was funny. We had a major trade (Street, Dan Johnson, and spec) for (Holiday, your closer Ramirez, and spec) before the season started and then we met in the WS.

Edit: Apparently, Asahina missed the playoffs due to an injury. I forgot about that.

[Porter]

I also prefer the 7-10-10 guys as starters and 10-7-10 in the bullpen.

[Trendy Bastard]

I can agree with 7-10-10 starters, although I can never seem to acquire any of them.

[OrioleMagic]

That was funny. We had a major trade (Street, Dan Johnson, and spec) for (Holiday, your closer Ramirez, and spec) before the season started and then we met in the WS.

Edit: Apparently, Asahina missed the playoffs due to an injury. I forgot about that.

IIRC, you won in the WS.

[zodious]

IIRC, you won in the WS.

Since this thread has gone on a million different directions... How's about one more....

What is IIRC? I see it every so often and can't figure it out.

[Trendy Bastard]

If I recall correctly