Which opposing pitcher in the AL Central do you dislike the most?

[Steak]

Twins have had incidents with two pitchers within the division. C.C Sabathia and Mark Buherle have made it clear that they hate the Twins. The gangsta has stated out loud that he hates the Twins literally while Buherle has made it clear that he thinks the Twins are too arrogant for his taste. All I can say is BOOHOO to those two motherfuggers. I don't like either of them and it's always fun to see the Twins beat those two. If I have to choose, I will pick Buherle. Sabathia is just a pathetic figure. Twins have owned him anyway. I don't care for Buherle. He has mouthed off on the team in 2001 and he backs it up. It was really nice to see beat the crap out of him on the night the Twins won the Central last year at his own ballpark. I get more satisfaction seeing him lose to the Twins than Sabathia.

[Porter]

If I was the Twins id hate Jose Contreas who is 4-2 with a 3.17 ERA in his career vs the Twins.

[Morneau_27]

Might be a little odd, but Kevin Brown from the Yankees. I hate that dude. lol

[Steak]

Jose Conteras sucks. He does not scare me. I thought he looked really bad against the Twins this year. Too bad the Twins bailed him out. Here is hoping things will be different next time the Twins face him.

Conteras and Brown does not bother me much.

[Lynch]

Buherle can blow me. As if the Twins ever did anything to him personally to make him speak out against us. What a dolt.

[Jennifer]

Sabathia is just a pathetic figure. Twins have owned him anyway.

You call the man a "gangsta" and "pathetic." Pretty easy to make assertions. What do you know of the man and what is your support for these assertions? C.C. is a sweet, good natured 24 year old man-child who does a lot of charitable work in the Cleveland community.

As for the Twins "owning" him I wonder what your support is for that proposition. He is 4-3 lifetime against the Twins and 2-2 this year, winning his first and last games pitched against the Twins.

[Lynch]

He's pitched 4 times vs the Twins already this year? That can't be right.

[Jennifer]

He's pitched 4 times vs the Twins already this year? That can't be right.

He has pitched four times against the Twins but my original source it turns out showed the final score and the starter not the winner. He is actually 1-1 this year with the Tribe 1-1 in the other games he started but had no decision.

April 17 - No decision - Tribe won.

May 5 - Lost

May 26 - No decision - Tribe lost.

May 31 - Won

Tribe record vs. Twins

[Steak]

Lynch: Buherle apparently made comments last year about how Torii Hunter was cursing at the White Sox dugout at the Dome when he got a double and how the Twins are too arrogant for his taste. He was also ripping the Twins for laughing at Torii for injuring Jamie Burke in a collission at Chicago last year. I know Torii and Buherle has no use for each other and Torii basically told the media that this season.

Jennifer: If you think athletes are great people from seeing on TV, then you are nuts. Athletes can be protrayed as nice guys on camera, but it's a little different when the lights of the camera are off. I can cite two examples. Sam Cassell, who is the point guard of the Timberwolves, smiles a lot on TV, but I got to see him when I went to see the Wolves in NJ and he was a complete dink to the fans and everyone. Cassell left to the locker room with 2 minutes to go of regulation and then when fans wanted his autograph or to chat with him, Sam cursed the fans off. Another example is Jayson Williams. A huge fan favorite with the Nets in the 90s. He worked hard and he was a great story. Little did everyone knew he had a checkered past and then he murdered a limo driver on Valentine's Day in 2001. Nice guy on camera, but who knows behind the scenes. My point is just because you see C.C. on television does not exactly come true. Why I call him gangsta? Let's see. Maybe it's because he wears his cap crooked. Why I call him pathetic? Let's see. This guy went out of his way to say that he "hates" the Twins in spring training and then he curses at the Twins dugout after he is off the mound in a inning of a game. A real character guy. I am sure proud to have a guy like that on my team. This guy instigates fights with the Twins and Indians hence why we have had brawls. What's next? You think Jason Davis is a great guy too. Puhleeze.
C.C. doing something good for the community? Good for him. You know Kobe Bryant does the same thing too and he is the biggest piece of crap ever.

[DiamondGirl]

Amen Steak.

Attitude on and off the field are key in overal character. I'm not impressed with CC on the field and he does what he HAS to do off the field. Most franchise guys have it in their contracts that they have to do so many community service events.

CC lets other teams, especially the Twins, get in his head after he's given up a couple hits and/or runs. He threw the darn ball - get over it! But there is certainly no room in baseball for the glares into the opposing team dugout or staring down a runner rounding the bases after he's given up a gopher ball that CC is famous for. He's a load!

[Jennifer]

Jennifer: If you think athletes are great people from seeing on TV, then you are nuts.
Why I call him gangsta? Let's see. Maybe it's because he wears his cap crooked. Why I call him pathetic? Let's see. This guy went out of his way to say that he "hates" the Twins in spring training and then he curses at the Twins dugout after he is off the mound in a inning of a game. A real character guy. I am sure proud to have a guy like that on my team. This guy instigates fights with the Twins and Indians hence why we have had brawls. What's next? You think Jason Davis is a great guy too. Puhleeze.
C.C. doing something good for the community? Good for him. You know Kobe Bryant does the same thing too and he is the biggest piece of crap ever.

If a player has a serious character flaw it is usually discernable overtime from watching him being interviewed and various newspaper stories. That some players are bad apples doesn't necessarily mean all of them are. You have assassinated his character based on knowing very little about him. As it turns out I do happen to know a little bit more about him than media accounts. I have a friend who's cousin plays for the Tribe and he came into town last January. My friend and I spent an evening bar hopping with him. In the course of the evening we discussed some of his teamates and he thought CC was a great guy, albeit somewhat immature; He was less kind about some of his other teamates.

He "went out of his way to say that he "hates" the Twins in spring training." Really, how so? As for "hating" the Twins I have two things to say. First, if you find it so lacking in character how can you possibily be a Twins fan since you yourself have claimed in another forum that since 2001 the "Indians have been a hated rival for the Twins."

Second, if you read the Twin Cities' Star Tribune you would know that the following appeared in the April 18th edition:

"I've stopped using the word 'hate,' " Sabathia said. "It's more like 'jealousy,' to see them playing in October and it should be us. They are the team to beat, and that's the spot we want."
Star Tribune

You also seem either not to have read or are choosing to ignore a link I provided you in that other forum regarding Gardenhire's understanding of what CC meant published two days before CC offered his own explanation:

Clubhouse confidential: When it was announced during spring training that C.C. Sabathia's first start after recovering from a strained abdominal muscle would be Sunday against the Twins, he said he would be fired up. "I hate the Twins," he said, "and they know I hate them."

Twins manager Ron Gardenhire said he had no problem with Sabathia's remarks. "[The Twins] don't pay him," Gardenhire said. "Why shouldn't he say that? He said it in a competitiveness sense.

"I would never hold a grudge against anyone who says he hates the Twins. C.C. should hate the Twins. He's trying to beat the Twins."

Gardenhire paused, then smiled. "It does make it more entertaining for us, though."
Plain Dealer

As for his cursing "at the Twins dugout after he is off the mound in a inning of a game" I had not heard that. Since you are being so judgmental I assume you know what motivated his action, so please share this knowledge. I do know that the jockeying that sometimes comes from the opposing teams dugout can get pretty cruel and vicious. Might CC's reaction be merely a sign of immaturity? I know it can't be the cursing that bothers you because despite the fact that some might find it offensive you yourself used "MF" in your posting that opened this thread.

As for CC "instigating" fights with the Twins I guess I always thought it was the result of the Twins pitchers headhunting. Is CC responsible for instigating the fights the Twins have with the White Sox or is there a White Sox player you want to blame?

What I find most interesting is that other than the way he wears his hat you rely on incidences occuring this year to justify your feelings for CC yet those feelings go back to at least last season according to your earlier post.

Lastly, I'm still waiting for your support for the proposition that the Twins "own" CC.

[Steak]

I have to get started at work in a minute, but I will respond about how the Twins own C.C. To show you how the Twins own C.C., tell me why does C.C. tend to meltdown after the Twins score two runs or how about when C.C. whines about the mound at the Dome in one of his starts there this year or how about when C.C. start making facial expressions after he gets hit. That's my definition of Twins owning C.C.

I will respond more during my dinner break.

[Jennifer]

Attitude on and off the field are key in overal character. I'm not impressed with CC on the field and he does what he HAS to do off the field. Most franchise guys have it in their contracts that they have to do so many community service events.

Where do I even begin to respond? You say that most franchise guys have in their contract a community service requirement. Do you have any support for the proposition. Assuming you are correct since it is only "most" and not all do you have any basis other than pure conjunction that it is in CCs contract? Since his community service/charitable activities go back a few years and precede his becoming a "franchise player" do you have any explanation for his community service /charitable activities for that period? Assuming again that it is in his contract do you know whether his activities fail to exceed the requirements?

He claim that CC only "does what he HAS to do off the field" (your emphasis not mine). So I guess my real question to you is are you relying on any "facts" or mere conjuncture utilizing one hypothesis to build on the next one.

CC lets other teams, especially the Twins, get in his head after he's given up a couple hits and/or runs. He threw the darn ball - get over it! But there is certainly no room in baseball for the glares into the opposing team dugout or staring down a runner rounding the bases after he's given up a gopher ball that CC is famous for. He's a load!

It is true CC does let other teams get into his head which shows nothing more than a sense of immaturity.

You claim that CC is "famous" for glaring? Really, what is your support? As for there being no room in baseball for "glaring" that may be true but it happens a lot when bench jockeying goes too far and when a guy hitting a home run tries to show a pitcher up. Regarding CCs glaring to you have any basis to believe that it is not the result of excessive and cruel insults from the bench or efforts to show him up. It would seem to me, though I have no evidence, that CC would be the subject of excessive taunting and efforts to show him up because opposing players know that this distracts and rattles him.

[Jennifer]

I have to get started at work in a minute, but I will respond about how the Twins own C.C. To show you how the Twins own C.C., tell me why does C.C. tend to meltdown after the Twins score two runs or how about when C.C. whines about the mound at the Dome in one of his starts there this year or how about when C.C. start making facial expressions after he gets hit. That's my definition of C.C. owning the Twins.

I will respond more during my dinner break.

That is your definition of "owning him?" That the man reacts immaturely? The man is 4-3 lifetime against the Twins and I belive is ERA is below 4.00. Not exactly being owned in most people's estimation. Show me some numbers that justify your position and I will concede you victory.

[Steak]

Jennifer: That is my definition of owning Sabathia and that's how I feel. If a player starts showing anger on the mound and cursing at the dugout, to me that's what you call owning him. Twins are in his head and his stupidity speaks for itself. Twins have beaten him in the last few years. 4-3? That's more than owning him in my book. Why if he was that great, he would do a lot better than that like say Mark Buherle or Roger Clemens. Heck freaking Aaron Sele has owned the Twins unlike Sabathia. 4-3 against the Twins is not what the Indians paid him to do.

If Gardenhire is not mad at Sabathia, why is it Gardenhire never mentions his name and why did Gardy took a shot at Sabathia last week for inciting the nonsense in the first game of the series.

It's one thing if a fan like me use profanity (I am not proud of using profanity BTW!), but it's different when a player use profanity. He needs to lead by an example. He is pitching for a ML team. He needs to be a role model for his teammates and the fans at teh game.

Terry Mullholland was actually very criticial of C.C when C.C. said those comments. Terry said that C.C. needs to grow up and not let the small stuff bother him. Terry also mentioned that C.C. does not listen to people. Terry Mullholland, my favorite Twin, would not go rip someone just to start things up. When TM speaks, people listen. From what I hear, TM and CC hated each other.

Twins pitchers headhunting? Now what the hell is that? I watch the games and I never saw any headhunting. I do know Jason Davis did headhunt us so the Twins responded in kind. When did I ever blame C.C. for starting up fights with the White Sox? White Sox start fights with their own by opening their mouth.

I will speak for DG. Most players are being told to do community work for their teams in sports. You see that all the time.

Why would Twins players go out and incite C.C? Huh? They got other things to do in the game than worry about bothering C.C.?