O'Brien is favoring the trade market over FA

[redsrbetter]

10/27/2005 6:22 PM ET
Notes: Reds look to trade market
O'Brien reports other teams interested in catching tandem
By Anthony Castrovince / MLB.com

CINCINNATI -- The Reds' splash last offseason came in the free agent market.
This year, it could come in the trade market.

General manager Dan O'Brien spent his trip to the World Series this past week talking with several clubs about potential trades involving not only his wealth of outfielders but also his depth of catching talent.

"There is not a target individual we're interested in, per se," O'Brien said. "It's simply trying to potentially construct the best deal possible to help the ballclub."

That deal could involve one of the four outfielders -- Adam Dunn, Ken Griffey Jr., Austin Kearns or Wily Mo Pena -- as has been speculated so often in the past. But the names of catchers Jason LaRue and Javier Valentin, who combined to form the best offensive catching tandem in the Major Leagues this season, have also been on the lips of opposing GMs.

"There's no doubt that other clubs view that as a real strength of our ballclub and recognize [LaRue and Valentin] were as productive as any catching tandem in baseball," O'Brien said. "[LaRue and Valentin] have drawn considerable interest from other clubs. What we ultimately elect to do remains to be seen, because obviously we're trying to take a big-picture view. But it's a frequent topic of discussion."

And the discussion always centers around the Reds' greatest need: pitching. It's no secret that any deal involving one of the outfielders or catchers would bring some pitching help to a Reds team that is starving for it.

The Reds won't satisfy their need for pitching via the Major League free agent route, O'Brien said.

"We went through those [free agents] with a fine-toothed comb," he said. "We feel it's lacking in quality and depth in an overall sense, compared to last year. As a result, we don't see nearly the opportunities going into this period as we did last year."

The opportunities O'Brien is more interested in are of the Minor League variety.

"We've had some good fortune with Minor League free agents in the past, when you look at Ryan Freel, Jacob Cruz, Jason Standridge and Randy Keisler," O'Brien said. "We've actively and aggressively involved as far as going after individuals through that route."

O'Brien's primary focus on the Major League front is the trade market, though he said not to expect anything to be finalized at least until the GM meetings in Palm Springs, Calif., in early November.

"I think it's a little early at the moment to handicap what will happen," O'Brien said. "I think we'll all have a better sense after the general managers' meetings."

Decisions coming: O'Brien's first order of business, now that the World Series is complete, is to decide what to do with veteran infielder Rich Aurilia.

The Reds have a $2 million option with Aurilia for 2006 that must be exercised within 10 days of the last out of the Series, or Nov. 5.

Aurilia said at the end of the season that he wasn't sure whether he'd like to return to the club, and O'Brien hasn't said publicly whether he'd like to have Aurilia, who lost his starting shortstop job to Felipe Lopez but earned everyday starting opportunities at second and third base by the end of the year, back for next season.

"It's too preliminary, without visiting with Rich and his agent [Barry Axelrod] for me to even speculate what will happen," O'Brien said. "We'll be following up very shortly with them, as I'm sure they will with us."

O'Brien said he also intends to spend next week with his front office staff discussing the team's arbitration-eligible players -- Dunn, Kearns, LaRue, Valentin, Lopez, Pena, Freel and Aaron Harang -- as well as Ramon Ortiz, who has a $4.55 million option in his contract for '06.

"Now that we're back in town, that will be a key focus for us next week in terms of putting together a strategy," O'Brien said. "Potential contracts, lengths, etc. will be front and center."

Good instruction: The Reds sent two of their big-league players -- relievers Ryan Wagner and Todd Coffey -- to Instructional League play in Florida with specific instructions for each.

Wagner, who missed the entire second half of '05 with right shoulder inflammation, was sent to Florida to work on his mechanics. Coffey was sent to regain a feel for his split-finger fastball.

O'Brien had good reports on both.

"Mission accomplished on both fronts with those players," he said. "Ryan Wagner is 100-percent healthy and threw the ball outstanding. Todd Coffey regained feel for his split-finger, and I think that's going to springboard him heading into Spring Training in 2006."

O'Brien said he was pleased with the Instructional League, which also included the likes of former No. 1 picks Ty Howington, Homer Bailey and Jay Bruce, as a whole.

"From talking to our people and being down there, this is probably as good a collection of talent and as well-run as our people can remember in the last five-plus years," he said.

http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/NASAp...=.jsp&c_id=cin

[redsrbetter]

All kinds of news in here:

- looking at the trade maeket. Now we know what is focus will likely be on. Sounds to me like he really understands that we could get some decent pitching for an outfielder and perhaps a catcher.

- trading a catcher? I bet it will be the more expensive option in LaRue. How would you guys feel about Valentin being our permanent starter?

- Looks like our entire core is arbitration eligible. We can drop Ortiz, and perhaps trade an outfielder and a catcher, but that still means we have a lot of money going to pay raises.

- Glad to see Wagner and Coffey are on schedule. I wonder if Howington will ever get it together.

[missionhockey21]

The Reds will be fools (no surprise there) if they trade LaRue. LaRue has shown that he isn't a fluke his stats show that he improves each year, *gasp* dare I say it, like Boone predicted. LaRue continues to develop at the plate and I think the effect of losing him would be pretty big in comparison if the team lost Valentin. And his most obvious flaw is that he very well could be a one year fluke I digged what he did last season of course but really, did he do much of anything different from what he used to do? His first season with us he took those big swings but didnt get the pitches to hit as much. With an improved scouting report on him since he had so many AB's, I wouldnt be surprised at all if all his offensive numbers came down to Earth.

We have to remember that this isnt a position we have a surplus at other than at the MLB level. We lack the minor league prospect who is close to the show that would make a poor decision here tolerable. It's hard to find a good catcher so hopefully the Reds make the right decision if they want to have illusions of competiting next season.

[CincyRedsFan30]

If we can get something for Valentin, OK by me. Trading LaRue would be a big mistake. He is so underrated by so many, and as mission said, we don't have anyone in the minor leagues. We could well be hurting at the Catching position for some time if we dump LaRue.

I am so tired of O'Brien's lame comments, BTW:


"There is not a target individual we're interested in, per se," O'Brien said. "It's simply trying to potentially construct the best deal possible to help the ballclub."
(Talk about saying nothing while saying a lot... "trying to potentially"...give me a break)

"We went through those [free agents] with a fine-toothed comb," he said. "We feel it's lacking in quality and depth in an overall sense, compared to last year. As a result, we don't see nearly the opportunities going into this period as we did last year."
(He better not be referring to Milton when it comes to "quality" )

I think it's a little early at the moment to handicap what will happen," O'Brien said.
(Is it just me or is "handicap" one of his favorite words? Maybe he is thinking of what his GM abilities seem like to everyone when he uses it)

"It's too preliminary, without visiting with Rich and his agent [Barry Axelrod] for me to even speculate what will happen," O'Brien said. "We'll be following up very shortly with them, as I'm sure they will with us."


(Translation: This has to take two months or else we are rushing into things )

[Kingdom]

Rich Aurilia has a large fan base, doesn't he?
[dry laugh]

[Geki Ace]

Jason Standridge and Randy Keisler were good fortune?

[Wally Mo Pena]

This is from the minneapolis star tribune:

"...The Twins appear to be in position to address their offensive needs because they have pitching to trade and many teams need pitching. So far, Jacque Jones, Joe Mays and Terry Mulholland have filed for free agency. Jones is the biggest name, and the club will not stand in his way if he gets an offer he likes, which would free up cash to use on other free agents. But don't be surprised if Ryan makes headlines with a trade rather than a free-agent signing -- but will it be the blockbuster many are hoping for? The answer will be forthcoming. Here's an offseason primer of what to expect:

1 Reds: Cincinnati needs pitching, and speculation has the team considering trading outfielders Adam Dunn, Austin Kearns, Wily Mo Pena or even Ken Griffey Jr.

2 Rangers: The Rangers have offense to burn and should burn some of it for pitching. Most likely offerings are second baseman Alfonso Soriano or third baseman Hank Blalock.

3 Phillies: The Ryan Howard era is ready to begin in Philadelphia, meaning the Phillies might look into dealing first baseman Jim Thome for starting pitching or bullpen help.

4 Brewers: Milwaukee has a first baseman in waiting in Prince Fielder and could move Lyle Overbay in order to nab a starter to go with Ben Sheets and Chris Capuano.

5 Marlins: A.J. Burnett will leave as a free agent, leaving the Marlins in need of pitching. Third baseman Mike Lowell probably is available, but does he have anything left? "

I'm glad to see that the reds are on the twins radar, though i doubt dunn will be in any deal. I think the reds and twins could work out a good win/win trade for one of the other OFs and one of the twins young starters. The reds would probably have to throw in xtra, but we need a young guy to be excited about.

[redsrbetter]

If we listed those names in order for offensive talent it may look like this:
(I am leaving off Dunn because I don't think he will be moved)

Soriano
Thome
Griffey
Overbay
Blalock
Kearns
Pena
Lowell

I have to put Kearns and Pena so low on the list because they are still going off potential. They are not proven yet and it could be a shortcoming for us in a deal. So, what are the Twinkies needs? Offense is the answer, but where do they need to get this offense from the most?

It has already been stated that they will need an outfielder in Jones' departure (if that happens), but a !B would be just as good. Morneau was not anywhere near the talent that Thome or Overbay could bring. So, we are looking at a possible need for DanO to speak up right away. This is where we lose big possibilities and I am afraid that another possible deal like this will not come along. So, come on DanO!

[Wally Mo Pena]

morneau had a disappointing year, but he's young, has potential, and is far from the worst offensive player on their team. I can't imagine that they will throw their resources at a first baseman when they have so many other holes in their offense. so i'd take thome and overbay off that list, or at least down it.

I'd also take griffey off of it because i think the reds have made it clear that he's staying. if the reports are true, and we have no reason to think otherwise, griffey was never even asked about going to chicago, so i can't think that they were ever going to deal him.

that leaves soriano and blalock ahead of kearns and pena, and i think that's probably accurate, the twins infield was attrocious this year, and they will probably make it their priority.

The thing is, the twins are probably looking for two bats, and they aren't likely to get them both on the infield (with jones leaving) or both from the rangers. I think their best options for an outfield bat come from the reds, and hopefully they are already starting to talk.

[missionhockey21]

We also have to remember that the Twins have been interested in our players before with no serious discussions coming. For instance with Joe Randa I believe I recall reading that the Twins were very interested but were turned away by the Reds high asking price. The Twins really don't seem willing to give away any of their young pitching unless the offensive talent outweighs it (I can't really list a source for that but it's my impression from reading various things.) Because these two teams have been matches for a good trade for quite some time but nothing has came from it, I am not getting my hopes up.

What deal would you propose if you were in Dan O's shoes (scary thought I know)?

[Wally Mo Pena]

that was certainly the case this season mission, but their owner and gm tooka lot guff for not making a single move with all the prospects they have and watching the whitesox AND indians pull away after the deadline. Their GM has come out and said that he is willing to deal prospects, and articles like this seem to point more strongly to that possiblity.

If i'm DanO, i try to get a feeling for which OF they like more between kearns and pena. then i offer that guy for fransisco liriano. he was 1-2 with a 5.70 era last year in limited time, but he's 22, has filthy stuff, and had great periferals. for instance he had 33k to 7 bb, striking out 12.55/9ip, his whip was 1.10, his opponents OPS was .687 and he had a 1.56 gb/fb ratio.

i think he projects as a #2 on most teams, and as a super ace on the reds.

If the twins turned that down i'd throw in a guy like hancock and ask for a lower prosepct. Hancock, or hudson, or kozlowski or keisler, any one of the mediocre starters the reds have could fill in as the 5/6 guy for the twins and not hurt them too much, since their rotation will be

santana
radke
silva
baker

either way.

i think that would be about as far as i would go. i would love to have liriano, he's the type of pitcher the reds haven't seen in a long time, and it's right at the beginning of his career, but as much as some people will poo-poo them, kearns and pena are not a dime a dozen. They aren't established stars yet, but you won't be able to find too many players that cheap, that young, with that type of potential that are on the market. Most of the time those players are on the untouchable lists.

[Geki Ace]

Liriano is the best left-handed prospect in baseball, and he's pretty much major-league ready. It'd take Dunn to have any shot at getting him, and even then, I don't know that the Twins would give him up. He's got future ace written all over him and has no obvious weaknesses in his game.

[redsrbetter]

The Twins are going to be sick next season if we can't tap into some of that pitching.

Does anyone know much about Baker and Lohse and are they worth a deal for Kearns/Pena?

[Wally Mo Pena]

i don't think it's widely accepted that liriano is "the best lefty prospect" in the game. geki, if you could post a report that says that, that would be great. Baker is the one everyone is really high on, and i could see trading Dunn and a prospect for both of them. Lohse might be worth considering, but he wouldn't be at the top of my list.

[Geki Ace]

Baker doesn't project as much more than a 3rd starter, while Liriano looks like he'll be a stud if he stays healthy. He was named the USA Today minor leaguer of the year, and I know Rotoworld loves him. He struck out 33 in 23.2 innings and had a WHIP of 1.10, both very impressive for anyone, especially a rookie. With Kazmir and Francis really not being prospects anymore, Liriano has by far the highest ceiling of any major-league ready or close to major-league ready lefty prospects in baseball.