Narron: Dunn stopped batting 3rd because he thought it brought bad karma

[CincyRedsFan30]

Griffey: Bring in team greats

By C. Trent Rosecrans

Post staff reporter

Before one of the Reds games in San Francisco this month, Ken Griffey Jr. spent an hour talking to Giant Hall of Famer Willie McCovey, whom he tied on the all-time home run list Sunday with No. 521 on his career.

Griffey said he appreciates seeing greats such as McCovey and Willie Mays at Giants games and Stan Musial at Cardinals games. He wishes more of the Reds legends were around at Great American Ball Park. Griffey, whose father played on the great Reds teams of the 1970s, said he didn't think the old Reds felt welcome at the ballpark.

"Especially a guy like Lee May who lives here," Griffey said. "The only time I see him is if I see him at an event. The Sparky (Anderson) situation (for his number retirement) - everybody who played for that man should have been able to come to the ballpark. That kind of stuff upsets the guys in here. They played for him. They're a big reason why he's out there. Let him celebrate, this is how you celebrate."

Only the three Hall of Fame members of the Big Red Machine were at Anderson's retirement ceremony.

Griffey said the only former Reds he's seen at Great American this season are Johnny Bench, who is employed by the Reds as a special assistant to the general manager (as is Griffey Sr.), and Joe Morgan, who works for ESPN.

"The thing that other ball clubs do to let their guys come in and spend time with you," Griffey said. "That's what baseball's about: the older generation talking to the younger generation, especially the guys who have been in this locker room and meant so much time with the Giants, or Reds and just spend time with them."

ROCKIES ROCKED - It's the pitchers, not the park. Colorado pitchers have now given up 49 home runs in 42 road games, and just three more homers in 47 home games.

Despite those numbers, the Rockies entered the game 11th in the National League in home runs allowed.

Cincinnati is the worst in the National League, giving up by far the most homers in the league, now at 134 after Ramon Ortiz allowed two Sunday. In Cincinnati, it's a good combination of the pitchers and the park. More home runs have been hit at Great American Ball Park than any other park this season. In all, a total of 152 have been hit - 77 by the Reds and 75 by their opponents.

The Reds have not been as prodigious on the road, hitting only 43 home runs away from Great American Ball Park.

ACEVEDO CLOSE TO RETURN - Former Reds pitcher Jose Acevedo is expected to return to the Rockies today in Washington.

Acevedo has been on a rehab assignment with Class AAA Colorado Springs, going 1-2 with a 3.29 ERA in four starts. He is expected to pitch out of the bullpen.

FIRST ACTION - Kenny Kelley made his first appearance Sunday since rejoining the Reds after the break. He pinch-hit for David Weathers in the eighth inning, grounding out to short, and then stayed in the game to replace Griffey in center. He recorded the first out of the ninth, running down a long fly ball from Desi Relaford.

STEADY LINEUP - If it ain't broke, manager Jerry Narron said, why fix it?

The Reds used essentially the same lineup for Sunday's game that they did in the previous two victories against the Rockies, putting Javier Valentin in Jason LaRue's No. 8 spot.

After winning the first two games in San Francisco earlier this month, Narron tinkered with his lineup, batting Adam Dunn second and the Reds lost the next two games.

"The third day I had Dunn in the two hole and I'm not into the Zen stuff, but I do believe in not trying to mess up your karma," Narron said.

[CincyRedsFan30]

Translation: O'Brien yelled at me, so I changed the lineup.

If that above translation isn't true, then Narron should DEFINITELY be dumped at the end of the year.

[redsrbetter]

Exactly CRF. DanO must be flirting the interim name around narron. Saying, you keep it how I say, and you may stick around for the long haul.

[Wally Mo Pena]

i just don't know exactly why you would think it's obrien's doing. Because of graves? graves is a whinner cry-baby whose sad because he sucks at pitching. i just can't think of a reason why obrien would be telling narron to bat aurilia 2nd.

miley said he was responsible for the lineups, obrien said miley was responsible for the lineups and that graves was lying, and narron says he's responsible for the lineups now.

It doesn't make sense to us, but for some reason they put aurilia second. I don't think we can blame it on obrien just because it doesn't make sense.

Here is what Aurilia has done this year:

batting 2nd .360 .421 (obp, slg)
batting 6th .407 .565
batting 7th .271 .411

Here is what others have done batting second and a comment for each:

Felipe Lopez .368 .548 (obp, slg) - batting leadoff while freel is down will probably go back to batting second soon if freel starts everyday.

K. Griffey Jr. .340 .411 - killing the ball, should be hitting 4th.

Joe Randa .396 .617 - seems like a better candidate to hit second right now, but maybe they are trying to get him RBIs to up his value as a run producer to the twins.

D. Jimenez .429 .421 - actually pretty good numbers from the 2 spot, but he's gone.

Ray Olmedo .500 .889 - i'd love to see ray, and his time will come, but until after the deadline, they'll play the vets to showcase them.

Adam Dunn .538 .250 - huge OBP, but look what happens to his slugging in the 2 spot. I don't think it's worth lowering dunns' OPS by 160 points just to get him on base more. Slugging matters more in the end anyway.

So as i see it, if you understand why they aren't playing the young guys right now, the only other lineup that would make more sense is:

Lopez
Randa
Dunn
Griffey
Pena
Aurilia (in the 6 spot where he has done very well)
Casey
Larue

But moving casey to the 7 spot would be hard for them, and i think the lineup they have isn't terrible right now. They're scoring, they're winning, it's hard to knock it. I don't blame obrien for it.

[CincyRedsFan30]

Well, I don't agree.

I don't believe a word O'Brien says. He's already lied in the past.

If Aurilia hits second when Freel comes back, there is a big problem, because Freel/Lopez are the best 1-2 punch.

I'd even rather Dunn bat 2nd than Aurilia. Look at that OBP. The SLG isn't so big in that spot to begin with. Just talk to Freel, who's biggest plus as a leadoff hitter is his ability to get on base.

[redsrbetter]

I think the big deal about Aurilia is that he has taken playing time from both Freel and Lopez this season. When we all know who deserves the start. right now, Aurilia may be awarded the start at 2B with some good play lately, but still he is in front of perhaps a future solid player. Olmedo needs to get some starts in to see if he can be MLB ready next season. If Felo can talk to him about what he is doing, to go along with what Olmedo can already do, we may have another young star in the making. I understand that hopefully Aurilia is moved soon, and he needs his AB to get us a decent return, but we cannot look past the bad decisions made by Miley/O'Brien to start Aurilia over Freel/Lopez. That was just horrible thinking and they were proven wrong with how well Freel/Lopez have been this season.

[Sea Ray]

Why in the world would O'Brien care if Dunn hits 3rd? "Maybe" OB has suggested Aurilia play, Jimenez, etc but really why would he check the lineup card before Narron gives it to the plate umpire?

That's a stretch at best and I'm not buying it

[CincyRedsFan30]

Because the change was made and then quickly revoked. I'm not buying Narron's "karma" explanation.

[Sea Ray]

Because the change was made and then quickly revoked. I'm not buying Narron's "karma" explanation.

You don't know that! The way I read it, Narron was thinking about it and decided not to switch things up too much because the Reds were in the midst of a winning streak. That's just the way I read it but the truth is no one can tell how it went down from that article.

These conspiracy theories against O'Brien are getting tiresome. Once again the lineup is Narron's responsibility and if he does the wrong thing especially after seeing what happened to Miley, then he deserves to get canned.

[Sea Ray]

Why in the world would O'Brien care if Dunn hits 3rd?

I'm still waiting for an answer to this one...

[Wally Mo Pena]

I'd even rather Dunn bat 2nd than Aurilia. Look at that OBP. The SLG isn't so big in that spot to begin with. Just talk to Freel, who's biggest plus as a leadoff hitter is his ability to get on base.

You're the one that's always touting OPS as the most important offensive stat. Dunn's OPS drops 150+ points in the 2 spot. Also, as i showed in my last article, OPS predicts runs the best, slugging is right behind OPS, and OBP is a distant fourth behind average. There isn't any real evidence that having guys with really high OBPs scores runs, except in the leadoff spot. Sure it makes sense to have guys getting on a lot from the two spot, but it's just intuitive.

I wouldn't sack all of Dunn's power to have him walk more. The walks are great, but the power is what's really important.

[missionhockey21]

Dunn only has 8 AB's from the two spot, that's an extremely small sample to determine anything. (FYI I know your point Wally wasn't really on that, I am just pointing it out.)

[CincyRedsFan30]

You don't know that! The way I read it, Narron was thinking about it and decided not to switch things up too much because the Reds were in the midst of a winning streak. That's just the way I read it but the truth is no one can tell how it went down from that article.

These conspiracy theories against O'Brien are getting tiresome. Once again the lineup is Narron's responsibility and if he does the wrong thing especially after seeing what happened to Miley, then he deserves to get canned.

And your believe that a proven winner like Miley was so clueless is getting tiresome as well.

I don't buy that Miley and Narron are both so clueless.

O'Brien has no real background as doing anything overly good in his past. I'm not saying he literally is forcing things into happening, but I do think he is pressuring some folks.

[CincyRedsFan30]

Dunn only has 8 AB's from the two spot, that's an extremely small sample to determine anything. (FYI I know your point Wally wasn't really on that, I am just pointing it out.)

Heck, it wouldn't be a shock to see no HR in that small of a sample size. I like the fact that he gets on base from that spot, although I'd still prefer he hit 3rd.

[Sea Ray]

And your believe that a proven winner like Miley was so clueless is getting tiresome as well.

I don't buy that Miley and Narron are both so clueless.

O'Brien has no real background as doing anything overly good in his past. I'm not saying he literally is forcing things into happening, but I do think he is pressuring some folks.

The difference between you and me is I deal in facts. The fact is Narron and Miley submitted lineup cards every night that did not have Dunn hitting 3rd.

What facts do you have that OB forced them to do it that way?