Harang and Arroyo drawing interest?

[redsrbetter]

Harang; Dodgers are said to be interested:

The Dodgers are exploring a trade for Reds starter Aaron Harang, reports Dylan Hernandez of the L.A. Times. The Reds seek "one or two players on the Dodgers' major league roster in return." Hernandez notes that if traded Harang would be guaranteed $15MM for one year; his 2011 option would become mutual and the buyout would increase. The Reds would have to pick up part of the tab.
You might be surprised to see the Dodgers considering a salary dump acquisition, given all the rumors of their lack of spending ability. But keep in mind that GM Ned Colletti freed up $8MM in the Juan Pierre trade, which is to be used toward a starting pitcher, second baseman, and bench players. $3.85MM already went toward Jamey Carroll, so Colletti doesn't have a ton to work with.
I'm not sure who the Reds are targeting from the Dodgers for Harang, but shortstop Chin-Lung Hu would make sense.

link

Arroyo; Mets are said to be interested:

The other target the Mets are said to be “intently focused” on is Reds starter Bronson Arroyo, who is the subject of “serious talks” with the Mets concerning the right-hander and possibly two other players.
“If Mets just wanted (Bronson), the deal might have been done already,” said one baseball official familiar with the talks. “Mets are also discussing one, maybe two other players with Cincinnati.” He refused to disclose the names, but the early speculation in these parts is that the Mets may have a player under contract hat needs to be moved in order for the deal to be expanded.
“This one could take awhile,” said the official. “Maybe even until pitchers and catchers report … there are a lot of moving parts in this thing.”

Link

I think the Harang rumor is less likely simply because it is coming from MLBTR. They have been wrong so many times before. I often wonder where they get some of their material.

The Arroyo rumor is intriguing though. It at least gives us something to talk about now. Like, what happens to our rotation if one of these guys are traded? Will we free up enough money to possibly fix the SS situation through free agency? What kind of prospects do the Dodgers and Mets systems have? Is Hu any better than Janish?

So many questions, so lots of time...

[Providence A's]

If they can save payroll and get some prospects for those two, then go for it. It's just tough because it seems this team is always caught in no man's land. They never commit to either straight out going for it or rebuilding. I know one can do both at the same time, but it doesn't seem to work out for them.

[missionhockey21]

Question the first: Why trade Aaron Harang at his lowest value? You could perhaps argue that he could sink even lower, but it seems pretty clear to me that Arroyo, after his second-half awesomeness (check my article), is at a high and he makes the most sense to deal for a team looking for actual talent in return.

And Hu? Wooh, shortstop problem solved. Oh wait, we already have a young shortstop that can't hit at all.

[redsrbetter]

Completely agree with both of you. It would be ridiculous to trade Harang right now. So many people who are for it are thinking we would see a nice return. I'm telling you, Hu would be the just of it. It would be more of a salary dump than an even trade. Not only that, but we would also have to take on some of that salary still.

Like I said, Arroyo to the Mets sounds a lot more interesting. I love the durability and attitude Bronson has. He is one of my favorite players on this Reds team. But, as you said, he is one heck of a commodity for a team that just missed out on the Halladay sweepstakes. Teams like the Mets may get pretty desperate.

[missionhockey21]

In an ideal world the Reds would keep both. If we want to trade either, go for the jugular (similar to what Prov said) and dump dump dump salary. Bye bye Rolen, Phillips, Cordero, etc. Spend it on the draft, and tease me with acting interested in signing Chapman (dream on, I know.)

If you keep them both, make some smart moves to plug holes on the roster and hope that guys like Bruce and Harang bounce back.

[missionhockey21]

MLBTR had an update from Stark:

6:02pm: ESPN.com's Jayson Stark reports that discussions between the Dodgers and Reds have "gotten beyond the tire-kicking stage" and that the two sides are "seriously contemplating" how to complete a Harang deal. Still, Stark's source says there's still a long way to go before anything is finalized.

[redsrbetter]

Wow, I guess this isn't just hoopla on the Harang front afterall. I hear wwaht you are saying and I think you are both right here. Losing Arroyo is definitely a set back to the present team. Knowing we aren't going to make a move at any free agents this offseason, we are likely not competing anyway.

The only shot we have is keeping them both and hoping the young team can progress closer to their ceiling, Rolen can change the lineup as well as the end of last year looked, and that the team can stay healthy (Volquez puts a damper in that).

Jocketty is at this exact crossroad. If you are him, what is best? I think all Reds fans have been asking themselves that very question. In your heart of hearts, where do you see this team by year's end if they don't make any moves at all? I see them out of contention. But have I been trained to think that way? Or is this bluntly looking at it the right way?

I don't envy Jocketty because he will catch flack no matter what he does. I am on the fence on it. But I think the best move is to have a firesale and try and get back close to MLB level talent. Go big in the draft and maybe even look at the opportunity to have the number one overall selection in 2011.

Haha, what a goal! But, I am not far from thinking it may be the best idea. I could stand watching Votto and Bruce mature, Alonso come up and become a big part of this club, and watch Bailey, Cueto, and Volquez form an amazing rotation.

[redsrbetter]

Also, I don't see the Dodgers having the money for a move like this. It would be likely that the Reds would eat some of the contract anyway. But if they were to trade Harang for salary purposes, how much would they take on? Likely not much.

The Dodgers have the great divorce and obvious money issues as they drop Pierre off to the Chi Sox and haven't added talent this offseason. They let Wolf go as well. So, the walls may not be decorated in c-notes right now. I still think this is a long way from happening. But I am left wondering about the return. What does Jocketty have brewing?

[redsrbetter]

More on the Arroyo front:

Mark Healey of Baseball Digest reports that the Mets and the Reds are in "serious talks" about a trade involving Bronson Arroyo. Nothing is likely to get done quickly, however, because according to Healey's source there are multiple other players involved -- including more Reds -- and because the Mets "have a player under contract that needs to be moved in order for the deal to be expanded," whatever that means.

The Mets are the rare team that is both pitching starved and who could take on a contract like Arroyo's, so assuming they're not giving up the whole world for him, he's probably worth pursuing. While at first blush it might seem like a good thing for Arroyo to get away from Great American Ballpark, with the exception of 2009, he's actually pitched better in that bandbox than he has on the road. Not that Citi Field wouldn't be a nice place to pitch regardless.

So it is Arroyo and more Reds included? We are talking about MLB level players and not spects here, right? If so, which Reds would Jocketty move? Brandon Phillips a possibility again? CoCo? Perhaps one of the plethora of LFs are expendable?

The thought is that the Mets are obviously trying to get better. But what are the Reds trying to do? It could go either way; are they trying to unload payroll? Or are they trying to do a mild firesale and get talent in return?

Nothing I have read so far says that the Reds are trying to get much of a return. Could this be a time where the Reds again trade a solid player or two for scraps?

[redsrbetter]

Ok, so we may be keeping both of them afterall.

Per Jon Fay:

A Reds official says that the club has not been talking with the Dodgers about trading Aaron Harang. He also shot down the Bronson Arroyo-Mets rumor.
“We talk to clubs all the time,” he said “Probably 99 percent of it never happens. We’re not close on anything.”
Walt Jocketty is out of the country until Dec. 31. That doesn’t preclude a trade happening. But my guess is things are pretty quiet until after the first of the year.

Link

Per some dude on twitter: (I am trying to figure out who he is)

Dodgers General Manager Ned Colletti on talks with Cincinnati: "That's all but dead."

Link

[redsrbetter]

Ok, better link this time for the "all but dead" talk. This is from the L.A. Times.

The Dodgers continue searching for starting pitchers, as their talks with the Cincinnati Reds about a deal for Aaron Harang have reached an impasse.

"That's all but dead," General Manager Ned Colletti said today.

So we may be trying to compete afterall.

[missionhockey21]

Honestly, if that's true, that makes my weekend. I could have easily seen a healthy Aaron Harang posting a sub 4.00 ERA in Dodger Stadium (or GABP) next season and then we would deal with the collective ***** moan of Reds nation, some of the loudest being the advocates of the trade originally.

[realmofotalk]

I understand that Rob Neyer believes Harang would make a great fit in Dodger Stadium, and sure, the Dodgers could do a lot worse for a #3 or #4 pitcher, but I just feel he's not the same pitcher he was 3 years ago based on his K-rate and BB rate, yet he's being paid like he is.

[missionhockey21]

His K/9 hasn't fallen off the charts, 8.47 career high to 7.87. I do agree that the increasing walk rate is alarming. However, I believe given a healthy year, free of major Dusty abuse, he would fine his groove and post a +8 K/9 (which put him amongst the NL leaders) and a sub-4 ERA.

Harang, like Arroyo, is one of those freak arms that actually like GAB. I know I could be delusional about him and what he could do in 2010, but Reds fans needed something to hope for in 2010.

[redsrbetter]

I guess Harang got a little chatter last night on the rumor front. The Reds were supposedly talking to the Yanks about a move. Yet the Yankees went with the Braves and Javier Vazquez.

The Braves pretty much got robbed IMO. And if this shows what the market value would be for Harang, I pass on the thought of trading him. Especially since his value should be much lower than Vazquez's at this point.

Then again, I read a tweet saying that the Harang and Dodgers talks are not dead. But, I guess it was erased. Now I see this:

There are no new talks regarding #reds and #dodgers and Aaron Harang, as reported elsewhere. LA inquired but CIN not receptive to offer

Seems to me like Harang is causing Jocketty's phone to ring quite a bit of late.