5/23 Nationals vs Reds: Aces Face Off

[AtomicDumpling]

Man, I missed the game tonight. Good one to miss I guess. How in the world did we allow 12 runs to the Nationals? Jesus.

2 more errors for the "best shortstop I've ever seen" tonight. That is 3 more than Felipe Lopez.

Lohse is toast. He is pitching like he always did for the Twins now.

I don't really have much to say. I am just depressed now after looking at the box score.

[redsrbetter]

Absolutely horrendous is all I have to say right now.

Why the 12 runs? Lohse was sick and Narron stuck him out there. I guess there really wasn't much of an option other than moving Belisle up a day.

Then, of course, Narron runs Coffey and Stanton out there tonight. Someone in 8th inning said we needed to score 2 runs in each of the final two innings (at that time we were down by 4). I replied that it would likely be an 8 spot we would need because I knew Stanton was going to be called upon. Sure enough, we got the two runs in the eigth and if we got them in the ninth as well, we still would have lost by 3 runs. So if we got eight runs like I suggested we would have needed, we would have won by 1 run.

It sounded ridiculous at first, but it was the tale of the tape. Stanton and Coffey are that predictably bad this year.

[AtomicDumpling]

I can't understand why Coffey had been so bad this year. He has very good stuff. I know he has been BABIP unlucky, but that doesn't explain all of it. Maybe the pitching coaches just haven't had any success teaching him the mental and strategy aspects of pitching. He has plenty of velocity and movement on his pitches and he doesn't walk too many hitters. His K/9 and k/BB ratios are good. His results can and should be better.

[CincyRedsFan30]

Wow, what a mess. We left after the Nats made it 9-1 but I got the jist.

Some thoughts/comments/analysis, etc:


*Freel had a great night. Hit the ball well and played some great defense. Even a ball that he couldn't have gotten to he retrieved quickly and made a nice throw into the infield. And that catch he made early in the game was great. I was in the RF seats (right in the middle) and saw the entire play. He read that ball well (made a great jump) and showed great range and closing speed in getting to it. He doesn't always read the ball off the bat well but his speed and particularly his closing speed more than makes him for that. I know some (not so much here) don't care for him, but the guy simply gets it done in one way or another.

*Edwin is looking a little better at the plate. Still swung at a few pitches he normally wouldn't, but he did look better (though you wouldn't know it from some of the fans around us...more on that in a minute).

*I don't like Phillips hitting 4th because of his low OBP/terrible plate discipline.

*The team seemed fooled by Jason S. after the 1st inning for most of the time he was out there. Not many good AB and a lot of ugly swings. Not a lot of hard-hit balls that were only outs due to unlucky BABIP.

*Lohse (I know he had the flu) was miserable. I told those I was with after his first few pitches that he was going to get lit up tonight. He had no control and his fastball was staying up over the plate and in the 80's. He looked bad and I said I thought he would get mauled, which he did. That pitch he hung that Simontacchi mashed to CF was absolutely awful. Belt high and right down the middle. Looked like a Coffey pitch once he gets ahead in the count before falling behind in the count and then giving in.

*Speaking of Coffey...not good. I was really surprised Narron sent him out there after 1.1 IP even though he only threw 18 pitches in that time. He has simply pitched WAY too much. They flashed the appearance leaders on the board at the game for relievers in the league and of course he was right at the top. Amazing considering his performance this season in tight games. I had to laugh when they flashed "Todd Coffey has a 2.08 ERA over his last 15 apperarances" on the board. Talk about picking out positive statistics(and I know that is their "job" there at the stadium...but really.) Ever heard of that thing called inherited runners? As usual, he thought he could simply blow everyone away with the fastball after he frustrated himself by not locating his non-fastball pitches. The hitters knew it was coming and crushed him. He really needs to gain confidence in another pitch if he wants to be an effective reliever and he needs to have better pitch sequences.

*Though I thankfully didn't see him (listened to the end on the radio), it sounds like Stanton was miserable. Well, he is, so that isn't surprising.

*I had to shake my head at some of our fans tonight. First some around us sprinkled the booooos at Edwin, which didn't surprise me. They also told him to go back to AAA, etc. etc.

*Dunn of course got abused as well. Someone must be listening Chris Welsh or be just as crazy, as this guy actually said when Dunn bluffed a bunt to start that one inning "I think that's a good idea to try to get on base like that there. The home run would only be a one-runner there." (basically saying we needed more Runs at that point and a HR would almost be a "rally killer" for the inning). I pointed out (so many around us could hear) when they flashed it on the scoreboard that Dunn was near the top of the league in Runs. It is sad that his Runs he has actually scored (combined with his other RBI) aren't enough. He gets on base and he brings Runs in for the team. Why do some not get that?

*After Griffey made a catch or something during the middle of the game, one or more fans yelled something to him. He yelled something back (though he was smiling, so it might have been good).

*Lots of Narron bashing tonight. I think pretty much EVERYONE wants him gone now.

*The Arroyo bobblehead is cool. Shows him in his windup with his face toward the "plate."

*They had other players, etc. wearing "fake Arroyo hair" on the big screen. Dunn did this strange "seisure" thing that they showed a couple times (I guess to shake his hair around?) They also showed Narron wearing it and Weathers also. Also showed a clip of Arroyo singing "Wonderwall" by Oasis at one of his concerts.

*Losing to the Nationals like this is pretty sad and indicates how bad things are right now. I said it before the season and will say it again; the starting pitching might well STILL be the team's biggest problem. The bullpen will get exponentially better just by having better starters who can give the team bigger leads and go longer into games. We better hope Bailey is ready very soon (if not now) and that Castellini actually shows his "burning desire to win" in the offseason by trying to bring in a FA or something. Let the young arms develop in the bullpen and dump most of the old guys.

*I can't say I really miss Felipe and his .659 OPS and always ?? defense.

It was an ugly game and frankly quite sickening but getting the bobblehead made it better and it's always fun going to games regardless.

[AtomicDumpling]

Nice analysis. Thanks.

Regarding Dunn, it is Marty that has turned everyone against him. Marty just hates Dunn for some reason. Maybe Dunn gave the little geek a wedgy last year or something. Dunn leads the team in runs scored and RBI every year yet almost every day Marty claims "Dunn is just not a run producer". How can a guy with so much experience watching baseball be so ignorant?

Regarding Freel, I think he is way overrated by some fans but he has looked very good in the outfield this year. I have been impressed by his improved defense. His baserunning is terrible though. Freel is a solid player and I like him.

I agree Phillips has no business at cleanup. Problem is none of the Reds are suited to hit 4th. Dunn could be, but he is best in the 2nd slot with Griffey protecting him. He gets more fastballs that way. Nobody else has enough power or plate discipline to hit 4th. Maybe EE some day. Maybe Votto, but he is a lefty too and Narron won't hit a lefty after Junior.

[CincyRedsFan30]

Yeah, well, when he's healthy, I would stick Hamilton in the cleanup slot and leave him there. What harm could it do at this point? He might well be the closest thing we have to a cleanup hitter right now. Let him take his lumps.

[missionhockey21]

Very nice analysis CRF, as always it's appreciated. I really don't know what to say about this team, from top to bottom. It just seems like nothing ever seems to click on all levels at the same time to get that winning formula. In some games, the bats seem to be totally apathetic and while we haven't set the world on fire, they have battled back in all three games but just couldn't keep pace with the snowball that rolled into a city crushing avalanche, otherwise known as Narron's poor usage of anyone who claims to be a pitcher. We then have Krivsky, who is an admitted big fan of Narron's, and Castellini who is a big fan of Krivsky (and supposedly winning) locking us into a cycle where everyone seems to love one another in loser brigade. Add in things like having starters who kept us in the game early on with run support that didn't exist, now we're scoring more runs but we're not getting starts that keeps us in the games or the various injuries and mega slumps and when looking at it from the aggregate... it's safe to say that this has been a disaster. The sad thing is, I am not even all that upset, just frustrated and I believe that is telling in showing what this organization has led us to expect for too long to remember (outside of a few brief glimpes of hope.)

Some feelings need to be hurt, whether it's Stanton being released (unlikely given his contract), Lohse being moved to the pen (he has the stuff that can shine for an inning and perhaps he can psych himself up big and be one of those weird personalties to dominate there), making moves in general to shake up this mess before any talks of sale comes up and ultimately for the front office to face facts regarding Narron. I believe Narron is a pretty good guy and he's probably a friend to many, whether or not he could of done more or less with this team I think it's clear that he just doesn't command the players respect to be the straw that stirs the drink and gets those boys ready to go at full effort. Obviously the problems extend much further than just him, but I think most of us still believe that we're better than the record indicates.

[CincyRedsFan30]

Thanks for the comments/feedback, mission.

Much appreciated and I totally agree with everything you said in that post.

[redsrbetter]

*Freel had a great night. Hit the ball well and played some great defense. Even a ball that he couldn't have gotten to he retrieved quickly and made a nice throw into the infield. And that catch he made early in the game was great. I was in the RF seats (right in the middle) and saw the entire play. He read that ball well (made a great jump) and showed great range and closing speed in getting to it. He doesn't always read the ball off the bat well but his speed and particularly his closing speed more than makes him for that. I know some (not so much here) don't care for him, but the guy simply gets it done in one way or another.

I love how scrappy he is. But I find myself comparing him to last season. Freel is walking at a lesser pace than last season and his AVG is about the same. This means his OBP is worse than last season because his walks are down. Matter of fact, his walks have dropped in each of the last 4 seasons. He struck out at a greater rate last year, so that is a good sign of making contact. So what am I complaining about? I just don't see him going theother way and slapping the ball to the opposite field for a basehit anymore. He is flying out a lot and when he is lucky hitting a ball over an outfielder's head. I like Freel. Love him at the leadoff position, but I just wish he wasn't becoming Willie Mays Hayes in Major League 2. We have enough guys trying to go deep every at bat.

*Edwin is looking a little better at the plate. Still swung at a few pitches he normally wouldn't, but he did look better (though you wouldn't know it from some of the fans around us...more on that in a minute).

EdE swung at more bad pitches again tonight. I still love him with RISP, but he is simply falling out of luck. Between umpires giving him tough calls and him hitting the ball hard and it not falling, he is still pressing to break out of this slump. You have to root for him but almost at the same time you have to beg the baseball Gods to cut him a break.

*I don't like Phillips hitting 4th because of his low OBP/terrible plate discipline.

BP's OBP is right at league average for this year. That is not a cleanup hitter, but on this team, it just may fit. He also has one of the better batting AVG on the team, and his K rate is way down from last year. I don't love him batting 4th, but until EdE gets going, he is going to be up there somewhere.

*Though I thankfully didn't see him (listened to the end on the radio), it sounds like Stanton was miserable. Well, he is, so that isn't surprising.

Nope, not surprising at all. He has to go. I think dropping him and calling up Dumatrait sounds like a great idea. Then you send Lohse to the bullpen and call up Bailey and send Milton packing. Milton won't be going anywhere though because of his contract. But it is a dream.

*Lots of Narron bashing tonight. I think pretty much EVERYONE wants him gone now.

Too bad one fan doesn't see it that way. You know what I mean?

Yep disgusting game and I didn't even get the bobblehead.

Great analysis bro. +rep bigtime. Thanks.